Hello viewers, you're welcome back to Afro-ETV, the project of the black community of Austria. And we are discussing today a topic called Africa and the Rest of the World. This is a project supported by the Association for Politicians of Uru. And as part of the awareness program we try to create within the work of the black community. And we shall be discussing a lot of questions that concerns us we decided to use English even though it's also part of the colonial language but the common language that the majority of people on the seat command because this particular topic is very important to us we try to use the language we command best from my right going towards the other way around i have Mrs Gloria Morena Mrs Gloria Morena is from Nigeria and has been for some time now in Austria. She is an educationist specializing in early childhood education. You are very much welcome. Thank you. very much welcome thank you thank you uh followed by followed by vera this is vera cyphax vera is also from tanzania he studied law but in austria she is working in counseling institutions for For example, Foxitpe and Nkare for some time trying to assist people who have problems understanding the peace of the law of the environment where we find ourselves. Vera, you're welcome. Thank you. And we have also, Vera is from, Mary Okanse just like the name sounds in South West Africa. She is from Ghana. She studied social policies and masters in social policies and also masters in global society studies and still interested in education has not finished studying teaching want to continue studying if you have doctorate degree again it's also in these areas Mary you're very much welcome thank you there's a seat that is empty you know because of the environment of and ourselves sometimes things do not work the way we want it to work the city vacants many comes are getting introduced but I can introduce it before now dr. P a or gray P is also from Ivory Coast F by Krista is a folks Bishop lab and is also professor in Africa's he travels from here down there and makes his own special contributions in the development in the continent. Ladies, before the gentleman comes, I'm happy that you volunteer to help our people or people out there to get a little bit insight on what you guys are feeling or what you could not see what you want to think the situation would be like on this particular topic Africa and the rest of the world 2020 we had an Africa symposium here we also try to scratch a little bit on this topic, and then we channeled our discussion towards the economic aspect of it. This time around, we could also scratch a little bit about it, but we will concentrate more on the individual, personal development and the political aspect of this relationship. So I will begin with you, Mary. relationship. So I will begin with you, Mary. Do you believe that there is a balanced relationship? Because I wouldn't ask if there is a total relationship. I'll ask, do you think there is a balanced relationship? Because studying social policies and global society studies, you must have more insight on that to give us what is this balance relationship and who profits more from this relationship thank you so personally and from readings and from following everything that is happening now in the world I know there's a lot of negotiation a lot of things happening between africa and the rest of the world in court basically when we see the rest of the world we know that the western powers china they are coming in and we put all of them in as the rest of the world in my opinion with everything following and, you know, everything I'm reading, looking into negotiations that are made and, you know, things that are signed to agreements that Africa is having with the rest of the world, I would say that in profit, for now, we think yes, oh yeah, they are giving a lot back to the continent of Africa. They are giving a lot. But looking into the future, we would say that no, Africa as a continent is at a loss. Looking at the negotiations that are going on now. Currently, they are doing a lot. They are putting in a lot of loans, you know, very subsidized loans from China to African countries, African governments and getting a lot of, you know, waivers and all of that. But personally, looking into the contracts and the negotiations they are having, I will say in the years to come, Africa is not gaining from this so-called relationship that is going on with the rest of the world. to that era where we were being ruled, we are still being ruled anyway, but it's more of sugarcoating it in the form of a paperwork and all of that. And I foresee that in years to come, which should not be too far from us, in the next 10 to 20 years, we will see that whatever negotiations, whatever agreements we had, which was supposed to be on a very, you know, equal partnership or whatever it is, we as Africans, the continent of Africa is running at a loss. We are at the losing end of whatever relationship that we are getting into now and we think we are profiting. we are getting into now and we think we are profiting. It's very interesting to get to it from that direction, finding out that there could be a losers in a relationship. Vera, won't you say that because that would have pushed me to the second question of finding out what effect this type of relationship, this losing type of relationship would have, both on the next generation of Africans, both living in country and those living outside. What is your own view towards this relationship? Generally, thank you for giving me this stage, but generally, since I am a child I heard this relationship was never equal like Europe, Africa and the rest of the world was never equal you have trade which is not going well it was never equal and it still is anyway the effect on the generation at large is, you know, like, how can I say it? You have all these people coming, of course the Europeans were always in Africa, they were always in Africa, but now the Chinese and other people are coming. So people are promising, oh, this group will be better than the other one, but I don't think so everyone who's coming to Africa is their agenda they are here to grab the gold everything we have so the Chinese and I heard from a lot of my fellow Africans say the Chinese are aggressive they are like the Europeans they are coming friendly but the Chinese they just come and open very aggressive. They come to grab in their contracts, I heard. I never read them, agreement and contract. They are just too harsh. For example, one person from a certain country told me, Vera, they said in agreement that they want to own their land for 99 years. Okay, they come and invest in Africa, but the government should give them land to own for 99 years? Okay, they come and invest in Africa, but the government should give them land to own for 99 years. Okay, yeah, so that they can invest well, and that country said no, we give you the normal investment terms. You can have this and this and some more, but we want this. And so the deal didn't go, and this country dropped. Said no, we will talk later about it. So I think Africa should be more careful who is coming to invest. Just to see what do Africa benefit from all this. It doesn't matter who is coming. But we as Africa said, okay, how can we really benefit from this agreement, from this deal, from this investment? Do African people really benefit? And when you see young people, they are so poor, they say, okay, we think we have development in Africa, but young people are poor, they say, okay, no, I I'll migrate to Europe. That's why African are coming to Europe because this so-called development has not reached everybody in Africa. That is my personal opinion. Of course you have, for example in Tanzania, you have the middle class is doing well, they have their jobs. You know, they're not rich but they have a good life. Like a lot of my friends are middle class. They're not rich people but they live a nice life, they lot of my friends are middle class. They are not rich people, but they live in Iceland, they have a car, their kids are going to school. But the majority of the people are country, are land. Those are poor people. They don't benefit from these deals we are talking about. So for me it's like this. we as Africans have to see how can we benefit from these things. It's not that the Chinese can come and invest, but we have to see how can we benefit. Not that at the end of the day we have so much loans and credits which we have to pay. If I could try to summarize a little bit on it. Mary was trying to say that this relationship has not been on equal level. You tried to say the relationship is also not on equal level. We talked about the effects it may have on the generations. For example, if somebody comes and owns a place for 99 years, that's almost a century. And owning the people for a century, those who may be coming after us may not even leave to see it expire, okay? And relating it to somebody who trains the children and who consents the children, what do you think that this type of thing would have effect in the psyche of the young generation of people moving around? Because I would say, I wouldn't call it drain-drain, because I would call it a deep culturalization. Because that thing that gives you identity, that makes you stay at your place, has been destroyed. You're now running after that from the West. And you're looking here, you're trying to identify, define your identity from the view or from the perspective of that relationship with the West and this affects also the single individual both those who are starting home, those who are traveling abroad and that's why I said you youths risk it trying to run away because they have not come to appreciate their own environment, they have not appreciated their own lives so the last effect of this relationship that is not equal relationship their own environment. They have not appreciated their own lives. So, there is a aspect of this relationship that is not equal relationship. So, you as a young lady training young children, taking care of them and education is, how do you look at that? Thank you very much. If I have to speak my mind or speak my opinion about the word so-called relationship i've not really discovered a relationship because i believe relationship has to be the both side i gain you gain or benefit from it you benefit from it it's been a language unfortunately we still have to use it relationship this is for me they just come to Africa to take to get everything out of us for example things that Africa Africa is a very rich continent many countries Africa is a very rich they're there to bring everything out so we run after them and cry for things back again then this is not a relationship for me so coming back to children education and every other thing we're seeing the education educational level in Nigeria for example to be precise because I'm in Nigeria in Nigeria for example you see people as being I'm a Nigerian. In Nigeria for example, you see people have been brainwashed now, been changed in their mind. They go to international school, they go to private schools. The school I went as a child in Nigeria is a Nigerian school, founded by the government. That's where every one of us, we are educated educated I brought my education to this level I am now I still appreciate the school till today because this was the only school we had that we haven't got any other option rather than to go to that school we got the best out of that school this is a culture it became a family school in my opinion it became everything for us because this school was found here and it's been established here but if we have if if you go to that school today now because of this so-called Western world business transaction and all of the above or whatever the correlation with that or say anything like that this school doesn't have that value anymore because it's being turned around these days. To make you understand these are local schools, these are for poor people and all of the above. And I'm standing here today in Austria. I came from, I studied my education, my first education in life in that school. So I will appreciate it, I will value it if that stigma still remains with us. We have our things like we made mention of before, one country in Africa, Ethiopia, they're working on their bambos because these are the source they have in their country. Using it to create different things and I believe every other world, the whole continent of the world apart from Africa they want to get everything out of us and leave us like that and number one majority of the young Africans now they end up lost in their self-esteem they are not sure anymore they don't know they don't even value their self anymore this is the stage I'm beginning to be afraid now. We are African, we are resilient people, we are rich people, we are well brought up people, we have our strong personality, our culture and all of that. end up not calling it relationship but psychologically to say for me is a disaster on our side. We end up losing our personality and value the way I'm seeing it. Without being too pessimistic or having a negative approach towards the whole issue, I feel it must be something also positive in me. What affects me most, what I always discuss with people is the idea that the average African talks about this relationship, this effect of the relationship. And very little is being done on their self-esteem, just as you mentioned it. Even those who were born here and have not visited back the continent still have that problem of self-esteem. It could be the reason why these people who make the deals or the governments who make contributions or sign signatures do not value themselves or do not have this level and try to sign contracts that doesn't equate and doesn't work for their people because they don't value themselves. So that's why they are going to say, this relationship, as Mary said, has not been an equal relationship. Vera, you want to add something to that? You know, brother, when we speak about that, of course, we also need to look at ourselves. We as Africans have a lot of challenges. We have to be open to corruption, especially those politicians who are doing the deals. Some of them are whole community. So when we speak about this relationship, we also have to look at ourselves. Who are we? Are we honest? Are we corrupt? Are we doing good deeds for our people? I think since I arrived in Austria, it's the way they, I think they deloitte African Zen. Africa is that shlech, that gives us, that gives us. That is the way they see it. Some people have never been to Africa but they see on TV only negative news. And that affects us of course. If you, every day you see just negative news, you say, oh my God, show me that as all big devil. So if you, if they bring all this negative stuff from our place, of course the people will only know that. Some people know things only from watching TV. The few people who have been to Africa, who knows Africa, say, oh, Africa can also be different. Say, of course, we have, we have nice places to visit, beautiful beach, but those things don't come, they haven't lived there for a long time. So for them it's, oh, Africa is... I remember one child, African child, told me, he said, yes Vera, in Africa there are only one people. I told her, no, let me show you pictures picture. So I have a picture for my family and all. She said, oh, this is a, oh, that gives out a lot of strife. I said, yeah, sugar strife keeps out. That keeps. So what I wanted to say is the picture we, the African picture we see here is different. You see only negative things about Africa. That is why, also the children who are growing up, they don't have a positive picture of their own country, of their own origin. That's sad, but it's the reality. Okay. Aminu, you wanted to add something? Yes, I'm itching in my chair. I need to say this. You know, you talk about, yeah, this is very, very, you know, I talked about the fact that it's not equal. For now, I think if you look at the, you know, the face of the agreements that we are going into, I'll come to your question about the esteem. If you look at the face of their contracts and their deals, their agreement, we see that in the present, we are benefiting a lot. They are doing a lot of investment. They are giving us really, you know, very cut interest loans and sometimes even for free. But I always say that the conditions of these loans, the conditions attached to these agreements they make, is appalling. So personally, I think that the African leaders, I know they are top-notch people. Well, so Leonard, some even came out of Africa if they think that the African education is not good enough. They even came to these Western countries to do their better service and all of that. They have so much knowledge. They know what is right. But I just see that thinking into the future, thinking for the younger generation coming, before they put their signatures on those agreements, is what we are losing here. A lot of selfish, you know, agreements that they sign. I mean mean let me give an example to my country Ghana I know that if you didn't want to go into an agreement okay an agreement for I will use this opportunity I'm sorry to interrupt you I will use this opportunity to introduce Dr. Pierre Opie. Pierre studied microeconomics here and at the same time he is teaching in Ivory Coast. He comes from Ivory Coast and has been a long time and the leader of the African community here you're very much welcome before you can we produce today because we knew you have some excuses so we wanted to begin before you came in so thank you for just coming thank you so much okay Mary I interrupted you yes so I am not living in Ghana now but I follow a lot of the Ghanaian news. And I read in the, this is an authentic Ghanaian newspaper. Okay, this is the Daily Graphic, and this is known in the whole country, and they give out authentic news. And I read that a whole minister of a health ministry I read that a whole minister of a health ministry did not really consider a lot of the things that he signed, he put a signature to. And now it's costing huge financial loss to the state for this signature that he appended to this contract that came in. Then you ask yourself, what is the penalty? And this man is still at post. Then you ask yourself, where's the dignity? Where's the integrity? If you think that you made a mistake, you step down, let the law take its action. But, you know, we overlook all these things and you look into the future and you go like, what is there for the younger generation? What is there for the children? It is not good enough. I think they need to go beyond looking at the $20,000 million and euros that they are getting for now, for that bridge that they claim they are going to construct, which never even happens, to looking into the future of our children, the future of the younger generation. Because so much loans are being taken and they do not even use these loans for what they claim they are going to use them for. It gets there and it's for family and friends. They loot monies and all. I'm not saying corruption doesn't happen in Europe. It happens everywhere. I'm driving at is that we need to have leaders who are poised for what it takes to build the continent, Africa to be on its own. We don't live in a bubble. I'm not saying Africa should live in a bubble, but my point is that we need to rise up. God has blessed us with so many resources that we don't need to be at the beck and call of these western powers where we are always at the door for the next, even, you know, traffic light that we want to make, we are coming to Europe. It barely makes sense. Why is it that you have the resources and you need to come to the person who is getting the resources from you for the money to make development in your country? Seriously, I sit back and go like, no, something has to be done. Things have to be laid right. About self-esteem, you asked about that. I think that we need to grow our children, the younger generation, of knowing that there is something good. In Africa, in Ghana, we say something that, yeah, we have something good. We have come to the point where the younger generation think that the best is always from the West, which is not right. We have very good things. Can you imagine when you bring clothing from Europe? Oh, my God. They prioritize it so much compared to the quality things that we have back home. Even the food they eat, they want to... They've conscientized the younger generation that the Western things are better. I came to Austria in the past four years and I've realized that things from Austria are so valued. And this is where you start training the child from. From Beyonce, let them know that, hey, what we have is valuable. I read news in Austria about this nose mask thing. Made in Austria. Just because it was not made in Austria and people thought they were using made in Austria, there was a whole you know, buhaha about it. If it happens in Ghana now, made in Ghana is what you will barely have anyone buying. And this is all about the self-esteem. It's about the esteem. It starts from the scratch. Let us value what we have. It's not that it's of low quality. It is of good quality I try African and Ghanaian made rice taste is good but we want the ones that are the brands with Thailand rice and you know jasmine it's absurd I think that we can start from now from today conscientize our children to value what we have we are valuable. We should wear our own. We should eat our own. And this is the only way we can move our continent forward. Yeah, I think. I'm sorry about being so fast. It's all just something that really worries me a lot. That's exactly what we want. That's exactly what it is. And that is the reason why the people who are sponsoring the activities for the Projection for Political Disability are doing this. Because they knew, they know there are qualities because of the narratives. And this left for us to use the opportunity to redirect and to retell the stories. And give a new narrative of the whole issue. I appreciate such ideas, so much work. Doctor, you, you were not there. We were asking about understanding this relationship between the world, Africa, the rest of us, and the rest of the world. And we were trying to think about who profits in that relationship. Is it an equal relationship? Or if it is not who profits there and that was when we're talking about the effect of this relationship on the next generation both those living at home and those living here and that's how we came into that level maybe you would want to say one or two things today Thank you, thank you my brother. I'm very sorry that I came a little bit late. I had some things to finish. And about the question, what I want to say is that, you know, if you go to the market and you want to sell yourself, people will buy you by the price you put on yourself. If you say 50 cents, they will buy you 50 cents. If you say 100 dollars, they will buy you 100 dollars. ਸੇরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋরੋੋ�রેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরેরે� will mean Russia. They say summit Russia Africa. Not summit Russia Nigeria. Not summit Russia Ghana, Uda, Russia Africa, or Kenya or Ethiopia. Russia Africa. That is the base of everything. If you know what you are and how you can value yourself. People will respect you. That's why we are selling our products so cheap. So cheap. And in the next generation we will see that we have lost everything. We have lost everything. Now, I see you are always profiting of everything. Of course we are not profiting of anything. തതതેরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোরোর� And who is buying this uranium? France. We buy the uranium, France will sell it on the world market. They buy it from Niger. So at a low price, they will sell it. At a higher price, the difference is for France. And if Niger has problems, they will come and say, we help you. Can you imagine this? Those are things we have to fight for. And the whole African country, no country can produce vehicles. In Nigeria they are producing innocent, BSA innocent. They are producing. But they are not being sponsored. In Ghana I learned that people are outside to do it. That's where we have to start. To take our destiny in our hands. If Ghana produces vehicles, and all Africa, countries can order vehicles like we are doing for China. রেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরের� Now China is even buying lands in Africa. And let me tell you one thing. There is one food in Africa that is Acepe. Everybody does the, I mean like kebab here. Everybody eats it. And now China is producing it in China. And they are taking the world back. Sorry but the Chinese produce also African clothes? African clothes, no. Can you imagine? That's good. Because we are not united. We are just talking about Africanism, that is worse. In reality, nothing. To go to Cameroon, they will ask you for a visa. What kind of business? And people from East Africa come to Africa, they say visa. But the Europeans don't need visas. They just need a visa on arrival. And that makes me sad. I will try to because we don't have too much time. We are getting closer. I would want to appreciate that you have already answered three to four questions we had here. The first one is where does the challenges lie? You talked about where does the challenges lie and you talked about the question of mobility. People moving from one country to the other, both mobility of products and all the rest of them. I think it's something good to hear more on what we think are these challenges. What are the challenges? How can we make two, three, four statements about these challenges? What could these challenge be? Yes. For me, the first challenge is to get food for our country. The countries who do not get food cannot develop. That's the first step. If we have sufficient food for African countries, I think it will be the beginning of the development. Maybe people will take that technology and all those things, schools and those things. Yeah, but they start with food first. If we are going to school and we don't eat, what can you learn? That's it. If you see the history of Europeans, the first thing they did was food. And the industrial revolution took place where food was. That means Holland, not England. England was the first country to publish everything because the Holland people didn't want to let other people know what was happening. But Holland was, let me say, the top producer of food in Europe. They made our food in Europe by those days. That means they did't start with food. Okay. So, do you mean food made by us? Yes, of course. Of course. We have lands, we have climate, we have everything. And there are desert countries like deserts where if the forest can produce to help them, it's better than food will come from USA and they will just launch food like that from there. And when we do that, it will be cheaper. When I buy food from Tanzania or from neighboring countries, it's cheaper than importing from, I don't know, Germany or from South America. It would be cheaper if, when we, for example, those countries who have rich soil, when they produce enough for neighboring countries, for the whole, it would be cheaper the transportation. So you don't have, and not only transportation, also the price would be cheaper because it's from the neighboring country. So you say food security is the first thing we should. Yeah and then schooling, education. But I do have problem with the education. I personally, not because I'm not educated or don't want to be educated. My problem is the content. What is the content of the education that people are receiving? To me, that's the biggest challenge, the content of the education, the content of the information, and the way the information is being, the creation of the awareness. That's where I get in trouble, because if I am being, just like Mary said, people are brainwashed that only something from the West is better, if that's what I could learn from in the school, if that's what I could learn at school, you said today the schools are now two different types of schools, one for international, one for... And you see, give it a look now. If the education, the content of the education is not meant for rural and local development, appreciation of self, appreciation of the culture, appreciation of the environment, and what you're saying, pricing yourself high, valuing yourself, then I don't know, I will still want to, what type of education do we need? I think what Sister Gourou said about Nigeria that you have, these days you have, within the country you have so many different systems. That is in Tanzania it's the same. You have the local except the same you have the local international school you have the high international and then you have the local government school I think that is total chaos it's chaos for the children you have certain children who have this education so there is no uniformity in education and that's a problem secondly I think it's important when we talk about education and school to teach the children also the old and local methods. We have values. Each tribe in Africa has its values, its things we can give the next generation. So these things I think in Africa they come in too short. For example, in most African countries they put away the... Sometime long ago they had this subject of... I don't know how to say it in English. For example, gardening or cultivation, land cultivation. Most schools have put it away, but it could help young people to know how after school I don't have to find a job because the job are rare so I learned about how I can cultivate I can sew some you know I think how can I say it Those old cultural things which you have to give it, that's why it's again, extended. Extended, the good thing, of course, bad cultures, we leave behind us, okay? But all those, how to cultivate, how, the food, when we talk about food, which food in Africa are rich in, for example, yes, in Europe they talk about sweet potato. But in Africa we eat it every day. So just to tell your kids sweet potato is healthy. You know, generally just to talk about the good things which are locally made and available. You asked about what are our biggest challenges that is making it impossible for us to reach where we ought to reach by now. We gained independence from our colonial masters so many years ago and we are still in the crawling stage. I just want to say that we are still self-centered, and that is one of the biggest challenges. If you look out for the next person, your decision today might be different in that signature that you are signing on that contract. We should look out for the next person. If you are going to pollute that water that is close to your doorstep, look out for the next person. If you are going to pollute that water that is close to your doorstep, look out for the next person. How is it going to affect the next person? If you are sitting in that bus you have not paid for and you are waiting for a controller to come before you pay, how is it affecting the economic situation of the country? So personally, I think that we are omitting that moral value of looking out for the next person. We should always do things looking out that even if it is not affecting you, how does it affect the next person? This is a challenge that we have as Africans. We are always not looking out for the next person, which is very important that we do that. And I also mentioned that in oneness, our brother said something that was very, very important. We should stand together as one. If you look at the African countries and what every country has as a resource, if they come together, I'm telling you, we can monopolize this whole world. I'm not saying we should do that anyway. But I'm just trying to say that we have a lot. Let us come together. Let us unite. Let us be one. Instead of looking out for what individual countries can gain out of the West and all of that, let us bring our resources together. Let us come together in taking decisions of developing the continent. Because we have a long way to go. Living a life of integrity from the top to the bottom. I mean from our government leaders to the person who is even a messenger in that workplace. Let us live a life of integrity. If the person who is supposed to control you is not there, are you living that life of integrity? We come to Europe and we go by the rules. We try to buy the tickets even when nobody is watching. Can we continue to do that back home? It will take us a long way. We see that in Europe, the Western countries, they are doing so well. It's because everyone is trying to live a life of integrity. The few bad ones are doing their own thing. But we barely see that way back home. In Africa, people just want to go their way. This is me. Hey, technical. Let's live a life of integrity. A life of truthfulness, valuing another person. Let us. We are not making the system work. The system has to work. I came to Austria and I'm like, wow. The system works. Book an appointment. And the time they give you, you work with it. Let me use an example in Ghana. I have a Ghanaian health insurance, fully paid for, and I'm not supposed to pay for health care services because I have my health insurance, which I pay yearly. But the challenge is that the person who is paid every month by the government to take care of you wants a tip before they take care of you and you ask yourself this is really a challenge the system is not working because of our selfish motives we should just make sure the system is working and it would be wonderful to live our lives there forever our children will have good future and all of that let us make the system work this is what I want to end with. I think that should have been the summary of the whole thing but we still have two or three questions to to In all this system where we've mentioned where things are not working, we won't say everything is bad. Or is there some examples of people or places where we can say there is at least some light in this part of the diagram? Because I do believe everything is not bad. there is at least some light in this part of that because I believe everything is not bad. You want to say something? Thank you, yes. Actually wanted to say something concerning the food. Our brother being mentioned earlier on. I personally believe we have the best food in Africa. We have food. Everything be you. Of course, we have the best food. I came to Europe to realize that we actually bless with the best food ever. My biggest question or concern at this point is, do we actually say it like that? Do we value our food? We have the best food. Everything you can have. I grew up in a very small village where my both parents farm. There is no chemical attack spread on it, nothing. We lived on these resources. Tia left Nigeria as well. We have everything in the farm. We have insufficient to sell. My mom was a good business woman in terms of that you bring this from oil to everything we have waterfall in my village that's how we have everything really from the nature and so i'm speaking about my i believe every other villages neighboring villages of town city in Nigeria or in Africa they also definitely bless that way we have the best food not only at the time I was like 14 15 years of age when I started hearing the word fertilizer so this came just like that from the northern part of Nigeria. I mean, my uncle had a very large plot of peanuts, really uncountable peanuts. This was his business. We had the avocado, we have mangoes, we have banana. My mom has planted plantation. We have so many things that people come and buy, oranges. You can count it, name it. But did I see those things really valuable at that time being as a child no really coming to australia you see one deal tiny thing in the price how am i 100 percent sure this is really good when we were in in china two years ago for holiday I saw the bar where we put up there they have in a secret place spring for their tomato for this dinner for this and that and that I was forced to ask the woman because I thought actually everything should be pure here she said nah this is a pure spring also they also have pure spring to make it look neat beautiful so you don't get that worm in that other unbeautiful stuff that's stained or attached to it really it was an eye-opener for me but this is bio when it comes to the market you pay the price of bio because in bio this is original this is compound this is a original issue that what you spoke about before that from country to country at least you find it cheaper, you find it good. So, but we don't really respect and value the area. And consign, coming to the health issue, you made mention of security. For security, it's really a very necessary thing in the whole of Africa, not only in Nigeria this time around. And the biggest concern for me here is the health issue because I made my family here, I have my family here, if I have to speak the truth I'm not sure bringing my kids to Africa to live there what about if any of them fall sick tomorrow anything can happen where our Nigeria president fly abroad for treatment, any other person that can afford it does the same. I as an individual can do that. So these are the point I feel help wise is very necessary, important for us in Africa, security, Australia, we need that, whether we like it or not, I will appreciate that. And the value of our culture and of our food, of our everything that has to do with Africa. For us to have that value, to be able to price it well, to base it in the right position that it really belongs. Excuse me, you know what has impressed me so much here? In most cases where we've got discussions, I've got individuals who have sat and have quoted so many books and many people. But this place, you're discussing authentically. And it gives me some joy. So I don't want to try to pay myself something. He's going to vote for you. He wants quotations. He wants to give you quotations. I want to give you quotations. He's not a coach for you, he wants quotations. He wants to give you quotations. I want to give you quotations. He is not a professor. No, he is not a professor. What I want to precise is that when I am talking about food, I mean, I don't know which African country doesn't import rice from for instance. Importation of food. That's what we have to stop. To produce ourselves. I mean in large quantities so that if another country is lacking of food, we can give it. That's what I mean. Otherwise, what is produced, home is always good. We understood. Oh sorry, you asked a question about what we should... Something is happening which is beautiful in Ghana for me. Digitalization of almost every system that we have, the address system. This is something that was not so common. But the current government, I think this is a thumbs up for them, they are really increasing in digitalizing systems in Ghana. I think this is where it's working I'm here and I can easily apply for you know my Ghana card I'm still a Ghanaian I still have my I can still apply everything is done online any things I can just sit behind my laptop and it goes through even you know for me this I think it's really good and if more countries who are in Africa will continue to you know improve on this we tipping some more things that we could learn from our neighboring countries. It's a plus. I think I like that bit of digitalizing going on. Excuse me, the sister touched a point that's very important. She was talking about no hospital, I mean no good hospitals. Or if they are, they are not accessible to the common person. Exactly. রেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরের� Can't we create some hospital with common standard, good, where a common person can go and receive treatment? Why can't we do it? That's also a point of the development. Let's hear the Germans say here also. Those are the challenges we are facing. And notwithstanding, we wouldn't go away from the room without saying one or two positive things that is happening within the continent. Some examples of countries where things are not too bad, for example, you've mentioned Ghana, the digitalization, I can as well say Nigeria is also a digital, very far in terms of digitalization. For example, in Nigeria when you go to the, you can transfer your money from one, from the handset to any place without any, and you receive in the same, the same time, you get a lot. It doesn't stay long in the bank. No, that direction is also some development. I have my contact number because of my knee. Okay, that's beautiful. So that's also development. So that will get us back to say, is there some other positive narratives from the continent? Of course. There are a lot of things, for example in Tanzania we have also this, we can transfer money faster without banking. You know this, for example in Tanzania it has helped a lot of local people to do small business. So they don't have big money but with their phones they can trade in small scales. So it's a good thing I think. And also for me I can send my mother money direct to her phone. So I don't have to go to Western Union and she has to go to pick it up. So when I send my mother the money and she receives it and can use it, not go to the bank. So it helps, it helps also their diaspora that they can help on. I want to add something with what is happening in Ghana in carbon climate change, you know, trying to reduce the carbon intoxication. There's this new law that has been passed using plastic, you know, plastic bags that as much as possible is been passed using plastic you know plastic bags that as much as possible is to a zero and you know the rule they put out is that it's very expensive if you want to use these items for you know you want to buy a plastic it's expensive it's just to put you off from using those plastic items when you even buy food from outside they are using more of these leaves to they are presenting it in a nice way this is where our forefathers started from eating in leaves and you know banana leaves and we have very beautiful leaves that we put food in and you don't have to go with the you know the plastic things it's all in efforts to help the climate situation to get better. And I think that is a good thing. I know a lot of African countries are also working in that line. We do not have the money to be pumping into, you know, all the transportation bits here. I know you have the climate tickets coming up and all of that. But in a whole small way, the government, I think, is doing very well. Importation of plastic things are very expensive. It comes with very high taxes. It's just to, you know, push people from doing all these plastic and carbon issues. Now the ban is that you don't use a car which is more than 20 years old out of the country you need to bring that in it's not allowed so some of these policies that are in the system I think is for the good of the country is really helping to also help in our climate change efforts in the continent I think it's a good thing yes because also it's not only on the economy, also on the political aspect of it. When we talk about political aspect of it, we talk about Rwanda being the only country in the world that has the majority of its lawmakers are women. So for those who are fighting for women rights, we should go for an excursion in Rwanda and see. This is also a country in Africa. And I hope as they sit there, their voices are heard. It's not only about going to warm the fuse. The victory of Rwanda is not a system, it's a person, a colony. I'm wondering, what will Rwanda be if colonies were more there? They would be fine. They must have adapted. That's what I call system. If it's a system and one person is no more there, the system will continue. But if all ideas are coming from one person, as soon as the person is no more there, everything collapses. No, but I don't think so. He is one person, but behind him there are many people working for him. So I think the ideas actually coming from those behind him. But he is the in front and telling, this is me. But General Rwanda is doing very well. I think they are working well together, like the President and all those behind him. And he is one of the countries who is doing very well. I've heard of two countries here now that I can quote when I get out of this room. One is Rwanda, one is Ghana. Okay. That's good. East Africa, West Africa. I really wasn't able to get down to the South Africa or the North Africa. I've been in a number of Ghana, I can say that. I've been in Ghana. Okay. Now, that will bring us to the last question. With all the things we've discussed here now, where do you think Africa will be by 2030? 2005-2004, api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api api ap রেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরেরের� desert, to Libya, they are in Kenya, they are dying in this Mediterranean Sea. There is nothing to keep the young people in Africa. If we change the mind, if we want to see Africa by 2030 to be changed, we should have some policies to keep these young people there. Because by 2030, those young people will be the decedent, some of them. I am a good example. We are here. We are here. I think just to add on what you said is, when we want to keep the young people at home, we have to create a place for them. We have to create an environment that they stay in. Of course. Most of people don't want to come to go very far away. Somehow, not everyone wants to, they just want to go because of the economic situation. I think when we can make that to stay, they need to create jobs, they need to feel home. When I have a good job, I have food, I have my family, I don't think I want to go away. But when I'm poor, I don't have a future, I don't know what... Then I said, okay, now I want to come to Europe to try a new life. Which is understandable, I think, even if I don't have anywhere to go, let me try this life. Yeah, we are a global society, I agree with you. But when we as Africans say, okay, we create very good environment for younger people and create projects where they can work and create, you know, good environment. So no one will go. Okay. You want to say something? Because the time is not about friends. Earlier this year or late last year was this revolution in Nigeria where the younger boys from the age of around 25-28 were this outbreak from prison in Benin. Okay, okay, okay. This is science. Yeah, exactly. They were actually trying to fight for their rights. Africa, like I'm saying, in 2013, like you said, I'm afraid he goes back or get what the way it is because we have definitely lost our personality our self-esteem our value yeah these are these are the whole thing that is playing part in our lives this is what was very much happy when this whole story came up in Nigeria was like I hope they continue I know many many lost their souls. Laiuda made their soul rest in peace. If they had continued, maybe at the end of it all we would have had some good concept out of it. Now that finally they've been able to achieve forgiveness. But now I don't know how it goes. I still respect them. I give you the topic. You can see that it went around. Dear listeners, thank you so much for having your time to exchange these ideas and thoughts with us. I appreciate you coming, I appreciate you leaving whatever you have out there to come here. I appreciate you leaving whatever you have out there to come here. I wish we can have another time with more people, more audience to talk on this issue. Thank you so much for coming. It's me, Aik Ukafo, the black community and have a nice day.